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#1 AAA

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Posted 22 February 2020 - 10:21 PM

Is there a conflict?

 

The WHS says:

Player Responsibilities. In order to comply with the requirements of the Rules of Handicapping, a player is expected to:

 

(ii) Have only one Handicap Index from a single scoring record, which is managed by the player’s home club in accordance with the Rules of Handicapping. Note: This Handicap Index will apply elsewhere, including at all other golf clubs of which the player is a member.

 

However GA says

(ii) Player Who Belongs to an Australian Golf Club or Clubs and to Golf Club/s Outside of Australia

Where a player is a member of an Australian club/s, and is also a member of a club located in a jurisdiction outside of Australia, the player is required by Golf Australia to have an Australian Home Club that is responsible for administering a GA Handicap through GOLF Link.

 

In addition to their GA Handicap, the player may be required by the other jurisdiction to hold a separate Handicap under that other jurisdiction. If this occurs, it is the player’s responsibility to ensure all scores are entered into GOLF Link, and that they are also posted in accordance with the requirements of the other jurisdiction.

 

Should there ever be a discrepancy between a player’s GA Handicap and their Handicap as issued by a different Authorized Association, the Handicap within the jurisdiction where the round is being played should be used. When playing outside of either jurisdiction, the lowest Handicap should be used


Edited by AAA, 22 February 2020 - 10:24 PM.


#2 Bogey Golfer

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Posted 23 February 2020 - 07:11 AM

with the new WHS I would have thought your GA or Handicap index is the same in USA Australia or Asia or anywhere

otherwise what is the point of a world system.

 

In Australia we have a Gofl Link number which use to access your GA index. this is held and issued by either a golf club or handicap provider.

 

you have to nominate one handicap provider, usually its your home club, even if you are a member at several different clubs.

 

if move clubs then your new club will issue you with a new golf link number but your GA will transfer over.


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#3 ColinCL

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Posted 23 February 2020 - 07:16 AM

with the new WHS I would have thought your GA or Handicap index is the same in USA Australia or Asia or anywhere

otherwise what is the point of a world system.

 

 

 

Which is exactly why we were astonished and concerned to have read this extract from the GA administrators' manual.


Edited by ColinCL, 23 February 2020 - 07:16 AM.


#4 golfguy33

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Posted 23 February 2020 - 11:29 AM

So you are required to have a home nominated club in Australia tick, nothing has changed.

 

You also need to have a home handicap in any other zone, tick ( USA ) 

 

And if you play in any other zone and don't have a handicap there you have to use the lowest handicap from all zones that you've nominated, tick ( eg played in the UK )

 

What I can't understand is the requirement from GA to log all rounds from all other zones into their system ?



#5 OldBogey

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Posted 23 February 2020 - 02:21 PM

Considering that most Aust pros have a golflink handicap, surely GA don't expect that all their overseas sojourns get logged into golflink. And then, how would they do it? There is no facility for players to add in any extra scores, only clubs have access to add them.

Weren't handicaps originally intended only for amateurs, not professionals?
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#6 ColinCL

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Posted 23 February 2020 - 03:17 PM

So you are required to have a home nominated club in Australia tick, nothing has changed.

 

You also need to have a home handicap in any other zone, tick ( USA )

 

And if you play in any other zone and don't have a handicap there you have to use the lowest handicap from all zones that you've nominated, tick ( eg played in the UK ) 

 

What I can't understand is the requirement from GA to log all rounds from all other zones into their system ? 

 

According to the WHS Rules:

 

So you are required to have a home nominated club in Australia tick, nothing has changed.

If you are a member of more than one club, you are required to nominate  one of them as your  home club which will maintain your handicap your WHS handicap.  Acceptable scores from anywhere else have to be returned to your home club.  There is no requirement that your nominated home club must be in a particular jurisdiction although it makes sense that it is in the jurisdiction in which you play most of your golf.

 

You also need to have a home handicap in any other zone, tick ( USA )

A player is required to have one Handicap Index administered by their home club.  There is no suggestion that another jurisdiction could require them to hold a second Handicap Index in its area and it would obviously negate the purpose of a world-wide system for that to be the case.  

 

It follows from the above that this Is not so. If you have a WHS handicap, you have a worldwide handicap which means there is no jurisdiction in which you don't have a handicap.

 

What I can't understand is the requirement from GA to log all rounds from all other zones into their system ?  

It is a requirement of the WHS that we return acceptable scores from wherever we play to our home club.  That is the worldwide nature of a worldwide system.  We not only have a handicap which is comparable with  handicaps everywhere and can be used everywhere but that handicap is based on our golfing ability as demonstrated wherever we play.

 

 

I'm bewildered and dismayed by the way the GA manual suggests a departure from the essential principles of a single worldwide system.  Does it show a lack of commitment to the common purpose of a unified worldwide handicapping system?  I hope not.


Edited by ColinCL, 23 February 2020 - 03:21 PM.

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#7 AAA

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Posted 23 February 2020 - 06:21 PM

Considering that most Aust pros have a golflink handicap, surely GA don't expect that all their overseas sojourns get logged into golflink. And then, how would they do it? There is no facility for players to add in any extra scores, only clubs have access to add them.

Weren't handicaps originally intended only for amateurs, not professionals?

The USGA system allowed pros to register..

But why do you say there no facility to add extra scores?

Assuming non Tour pros are allowed to enter a 'nominally' amateur competition (under the terms of competition), whey can't their score be included with all players?



#8 OldBogey

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Posted 23 February 2020 - 06:59 PM

The USGA system allowed pros to register..
But why do you say there no facility to add extra scores?
Assuming non Tour pros are allowed to enter a 'nominally' amateur competition (under the terms of competition), whey can't their score be included with all players?


1. Only their home club can enter extra scores into golflink. There is no facility for players to do it themselves, even if they are pros.

2. They can be included.
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#9 AAA

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Posted 24 February 2020 - 01:39 AM

1. Only their home club can enter extra scores into golflink. There is no facility for players to do it themselves, even if they are pros.

Do you mean that everyone has to wait for an 'administrator' to enter scores into a terminal for them?



#10 AAA

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Posted 24 February 2020 - 01:53 AM

 

However GA says

(ii) Player Who Belongs to an Australian Golf Club or Clubs and to Golf Club/s Outside of Australia

 

I wonder if this is a factor?

 

Due to data protection laws, Australia’s national computerised handicapping service (GOLF Link) is not configured under the World Handicap System to integrate with a computerised handicapping service in any other country. It is entirely the responsibility of a visiting international player to ensure their scores are returned to their home club as soon as the PCC is available.



#11 OldBogey

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Posted 24 February 2020 - 11:48 AM

Do you mean that everyone has to wait for an 'administrator' to enter scores into a terminal for them?


Yes. Normally done as processing a competition. But anything else is extra work by an admin. In many clubs, the pro shop staff do all that stuff.
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#12 AAA

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Posted 24 February 2020 - 07:45 PM

Have I understood correctly, after a comp players do'y enter their scores into 'the system' but someone else does them all? Or do you mean just social/casual scores?



#13 Bogey Golfer

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Posted 25 February 2020 - 05:42 AM

Have I understood correctly, after a comp players do'y enter their scores into 'the system' but someone else does them all? Or do you mean just social/casual scores?

some clubs have auto scanner and cards are scanned in directly.

for smaller clubs or comps the office or pro shop may enter manually,(usually hole by hole so a bit longer process)

 

not many players enter social scores, but to have it entered playa has to declare at start of round its for handicapping, and play the same format as competition, usually stableford.(no gimmes etc) 

one cannot just play and then have a good score then enter the score. once comp is closed off for day cannot enter your score for that day.


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2012 winner of BHIC and gaining a 5 year exemption


#14 OldBogey

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Posted 25 February 2020 - 03:58 PM

Have I understood correctly, after a comp players do'y enter their scores into 'the system' but someone else does them all? Or do you mean just social/casual scores?


1. Larger clubs - typically two or more competitions of over 100 players each week plus other smaller comps. Players book a tee time via a web interface. On arrival for their round, scorecards are pre-printed with name, playing handicap and other details of the comp. After play, cards are signed and scanned into the system. Each player verifies the accuracy of the scan and deposits his card into the assigned box. Results up to that time are usually on display on a screen in the clubhouse and, in some cases, also visible on a web site. At the end of the day, the comp is closed, along with any others that day, official results published and scores uploaded into golflink. Hopefully, someone has verified that winners cards are valid.

2. Mid-level clubs - those that aren't in a position to pay for the bells and whistles as above. Possibly have a pre-booking web facility, cards may be pre-printed or printed on demand if a card scanning system is used or scorecards may simply be manual. At completion of the round, if card scanning is not available, hole-by-hole scores are entered and the signed card deposited. Running results may be displayed. End of day as above.

3. Small clubs - everything is done manually. At the end of the day, the club handicapper enters each player's total score into golflink via a web interface, usually checking each card during the process.

In all cases, any extra scores outside of a comp are handled by the club, not the player. No players enter any scores outside of a comp and those they do enter should be verified by a club official. It's usually too big a job and probably only those who win something have their cards checked.

There are numerous social golf clubs that are not associated with any one club, but many of those are registered with a golf 'league' and have the same golflink access facilities as other small clubs.

Hopefully, that explains the situation in Australia. Nearly all golf is played in comps. Any social rounds are typically ignored for handicapping.
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#15 AAA

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Posted 25 February 2020 - 06:43 PM

Many thanks






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