Topic: AB: The Gloves Come Off!

The end of the thread

This will be the end of the AB: The Gloves are Off Thread. The thread has successfully run for 167 days and has generated just under 37,000 views. This has truly surpassed the expectations I had when I first started on this project.

I hope people have found it both informative and helpful for improving their golf. I can guarantee all who have read and participated in it, that I have learnt just as much about golf and my game in the process of writing it.

Unfortunately the undertones contained within these forums make it simply untenable to continue providing decent high quality information in a civil manner. Rather than bring further disrepute to the thread, the site and my personal character, I would rather simply shut my information contribution down on ISG

My passion for golf and helping others play better levels of golf will be unyielding and will never end. A forum based platform is not the way I see this future information sharing continue though.

I am not quitting the site as there are good people here that I wish to remain friends with and see their progress continue in what is a wonderful game. I will simply be dropping back into the background and only comment on things that I see fit to comment on. My motivation however to provide quality free information via ISG though has dropped to an all time low and as such I will not be contributing anymore in this capacity.

With that being said, please shut this thread down Madam, as a thread contributor I have had a gutful of the cancerous entities that exist on this site, and consequently I feel my time is better spent pursuing other avenues within both golf and other internet information sharing projects I will now embark on.

Kindest regards,

AB

It is quite possible that your sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others.

God forgives people, that’s not my job….

Per your request AB- good luck in your journey and with your new little one. It puts life in perspective.

Topic: AB: The Gloves Come Off!

arhh, short and sweet.. the best way to understand why something complex happens right??

Topic: AB: The Gloves Come Off!

shit whats happened?

currently…………swinging.

I see, just had a look around and saw whats going on…..

Oh well,better off where I am anyway,....all they talk about is “golf” its short and sweet and to the point…......no long drawn out posts,except for me lol

Topic: AB: The Gloves Come Off!

Damo
thanks heaps for your help, free advice and everything else i have picked up for free on your thread. Special thanks for the Victoria game too, that has to be a highlight for me.
I know where to find you so all is not lost.
enjoy #2 and the path you take
Muzza

Topic: AB: The Gloves Come Off!

Glad to hear you’re not vanishing altogether and feel sorry for those who have missed out on your knowledge via your thread.
Few experienced players are willing to help others jump on their curt tails and follow in their footsteps. I found your help to be always giving, without wish for reward or gratification. For those of us lucky enough to stay under your guidance I hope we can produce outcomes to proove your teachings worthy.
Welcome on my journey anytime. Till we have another round or pick your golfing brain.

VTPP534
The other AB (AB2)

http://www.victoriagolf.com.au

’This isn’t a bad track…….have you played Victoria?’

http://golfecoach.com/dap/a…

thats a feckn great post jimmy

Topic: AB: The Gloves Come Off!

Glad to hear you’re not vanishing altogether and feel sorry for those who have missed out on your knowledge via your thread.
Few experienced players are willing to help others jump on their curt tails and follow in their footsteps. I found your help to be always giving, without wish for reward or gratification. For those of us lucky enough to stay under your guidance I hope we can produce outcomes to proove your teachings worthy.
Welcome on my journey anytime. Till we have another round or pick your golfing brain.

Topic: AB: The Gloves Come Off!

Boys I can be contacted directly at damop76 AT gmail DOT com

Won’t go into details here, just sick of the F-wit factor!

Topic: AB: The Gloves Come Off!

G’day AB,

Thanks for all the tips in this thread. If I ever run into you at Growling Frog, I’ll certainly buy you a beer for saving me plenty of shots with the course management stuff.

Cheers,

Pete

Topic: AB: The Gloves Come Off!

shit whats happened?

currently…………swinging.

+ 1

I read last night and all was normal or so I thought…

Cheers AB for all the sound advice and just… alternative ways to think about the game you have given us.

I unfortunately don’t have your details but will look forward to your occasional input to Gaz and others threads along the way.

Best wishes to you in your long term golfing goals and all the best to your family also.

Alan

Topic: AB: The Gloves Come Off!

shit whats happened?

Topic: AB: The Gloves Come Off!

The end of the thread

This will be the end of the AB: The Gloves are Off Thread. The thread has successfully run for 167 days and has generated just under 37,000 views. This has truly surpassed the expectations I had when I first started on this project.

I hope people have found it both informative and helpful for improving their golf. I can guarantee all who have read and participated in it, that I have learnt just as much about golf and my game in the process of writing it.

Unfortunately the undertones contained within these forums make it simply untenable to continue providing decent high quality information in a civil manner. Rather than bring further disrepute to the thread, the site and my personal character, I would rather simply shut my information contribution down on ISG

My passion for golf and helping others play better levels of golf will be unyielding and will never end. A forum based platform is not the way I see this future information sharing continue though.

I am not quitting the site as there are good people here that I wish to remain friends with and see their progress continue in what is a wonderful game. I will simply be dropping back into the background and only comment on things that I see fit to comment on. My motivation however to provide quality free information via ISG though has dropped to an all time low and as such I will not be contributing anymore in this capacity.

With that being said, please shut this thread down Madam, as a thread contributor I have had a gutful of the cancerous entities that exist on this site, and consequently I feel my time is better spent pursuing other avenues within both golf and other internet information sharing projects I will now embark on.

Kindest regards,

AB

It is quite possible that your sole purpose in life is simply to serve as a warning to others.

God forgives people, that’s not my job….

Damo,I have kept my word,Im here but in the background,I certainly hope we are still cool.
Unfortunately I erred,....but ,you know something ,I learned heaps about mental illnesses,so something good has come of it lol.
I have not been following anything in particular,just browsing when I came on this about your thread,sorry to see you shut it down….....Cheers mate and hope is well with you and your family good luck…..........Still firmly believe you should have kept your L/D going….but,Im not doing those hard yards…..you are…good luck

Topic: AB: The Gloves Come Off!

Peace out.

Topic: AB: The Gloves Come Off!

Don’t worry guys, there is already a new more positive project in store, one that is free of the BS characters that this forum invites ;)

Thanks for all the kind sentiments, as one door closes another will open.

My email will always be open for any of you to come and talk about your golf.

Topic: AB: The Gloves Come Off!

I’ll echo GPJ AB… drop into my ‘journey’ thread anytime you like. It doesn’t get too much of a run, but I come back to it every now and then to recap and relive.

You’ve given out a heap of great advice on here, I for one have been bettered for it.

At least you might have a little more time for the new AB offspring…

Topic: AB: The Gloves Come Off!

Sad to hear Damo – but I have your number, and I know where you live…..until you shift….and then I still have your number. Until you change it. Or the AVO kicks in.

Cheers mate, and all the best – let’s get out to the ‘bat or Frog soon.

Topic: AB: The Gloves Come Off!

For those of us who have followed your thread AB, and learnt a hell of a lot along the way, it is a shame that it has come to this …....... as I believe a lot of us have really benefitted from your input.

Having said that though …....... I understand where you’re coming from buddy, so onward and upward for you (with the one exception being you’re golf handicap).

Feel free as always though, if your’re of a mind, to drop in on my own “journey” thread whenever you like, and give me a good slapping or rev up if needed buddy.

All the best Damo …....... and thanks for the many, many pointers and words of encouragement along the way.

Topic: AB: The Gloves Come Off!

The end of the thread

This will be the end of the AB: The Gloves are Off Thread. The thread has successfully run for 167 days and has generated just under 37,000 views. This has truly surpassed the expectations I had when I first started on this project.

I hope people have found it both informative and helpful for improving their golf. I can guarantee all who have read and participated in it, that I have learnt just as much about golf and my game in the process of writing it.

Unfortunately the undertones contained within these forums make it simply untenable to continue providing decent high quality information in a civil manner. Rather than bring further disrepute to the thread, the site and my personal character, I would rather simply shut my information contribution down on ISG

My passion for golf and helping others play better levels of golf will be unyielding and will never end. A forum based platform is not the way I see this future information sharing continue though.

I am not quitting the site as there are good people here that I wish to remain friends with and see their progress continue in what is a wonderful game. I will simply be dropping back into the background and only comment on things that I see fit to comment on. My motivation however to provide quality free information via ISG though has dropped to an all time low and as such I will not be contributing anymore in this capacity.

With that being said, please shut this thread down Madam, as a thread contributor I have had a gutful of the cancerous entities that exist on this site, and consequently I feel my time is better spent pursuing other avenues within both golf and other internet information sharing projects I will now embark on.

Kindest regards,

AB

Topic: AB: The Gloves Come Off!

Just on what Dave said though

Look pros only hit between 55-65% of fairways in a good week….WTF are we doing flaying away with driver on every hole

Don’t fool yourself guys, the pros are deadly accurate off the tee! Yes the stats may say they only hit 55-65% of the fairways but their average drive when on the fairway is 7.9 metres from dead centre of the fairway and their misses are on average only 7.1 metres from the edge of the fairway. Take into account also that the courses the play events on have narrower fairways, and that the further you hit a golf ball, the narrower the target actually is… Think about it… half a degree out over 200 metres is only a short miss, half a degree over 270-280 metres is significantly larger.

The further you hit the ball the narrower your target area actually is.

I used to think the “big hitting advantage” was in how far you could hit the ball off the tee. The advantage though is in what club you CAN hit off the tee.

By that I mean, if someone has to hit a 10 degree driver to get it 200 metres down the fairway, and another guy can hit a 4 iron off the tee 220, who has the advantage? The guy hitting the iron has a shorter club with more loft. His miss is going to be less penal than the guy hitting the lower lofted longer club. That is the advantage of length in my opinion… Not how far you can hit it, but the number of options you have to “get it around safely”

Topic: AB: The Gloves Come Off!

That’s a great post Dave, I like the “3 chance theory”, it is very true. What do you have if you miss the fairway? You have to hit a recovery shot, a chip out or an advancement shot… Or worse you hit it in a hazard, take a penalty and have to do it all again.

So how do we assess a tee shot in terms of what we are doing and what we are going to hit?

This is the way I personally do it…

1. I will look at the layout of the hole, where is the trouble and what is the overall width of the hole? If the hole looks really narrow and there is no room for error, the driver is out of the equation immediately. How far is it to carry the trouble and does the hole open up beyond the trouble? If I am able to carry the trouble and the hole opens up beyond the trouble, then I will consider hitting driver. If I can’t carry the trouble, how far is it to reach it? I will be choosing a club that I can’t reach the trouble with.

2. I look at the hole’s length. For me, my “scoring zone” is 7 iron down. If I can get a 7 iron or less into a hole I feel I have a pretty good chance of hitting the green or scoring well on the hole. For me a 7 iron is about a 162 metre club. Generally though I am thinking “inside 150” (8 iron down). What is the least amount of club I need to hit off this tee to get the ball inside 150? If I can hit 5 iron off the tee and have an 8 iron into the green, why would I push the limits by pulling driver and giving myself a chance of missing everything?

Of course I am also always thinking, can I reach the green or around the green from the tee? Are the conditions in my favour? Am I driving the ball well? Is the potential reward higher than the potential risk?

3. How am I striking the ball today? Am I hitting driver well? Am I hitting 3 wood well? Hybrid? or do I hit an iron? No point grabbing a club you are not currently hitting well for the “chance” that you will hit a good one. No point grabbing a club that you have no confidence in. Which shape am I most likely to hit given my current ball striking form? How does that fit into this holes layout? I personally don’t hit shots I am not 100% comfortable with. So if it is a draw hole and I am hitting a cut, I am looking at club and distance that allows me to play a cut! No point psyching up to hit a “magic draw” and ending up hitting your current tendency anyway which leaves you deeper in the shit.

This is my process for choosing my tee shot. I would like to add one extra process for higher handicap or shorter hitting golfers to this selection. And it is based on the “scoring zone” above….

What is the lowest lofted club that you are confident you can attack a pin with? How far do you hit this club? This represents the limit of your “scoring zone”?

For me the best golf is played the more often you get a scoring zone club in your hands for an approach to the green.

Off the tee, can you get inside this scoring zone safely? If the answer is no, why force the issue off the tee? Why not use two shots to get your third (or three shots on a par 5 to have your fourth) inside that scoring zone? Think about it, if you are hitting your third into a par 4 with a club you have confidence of flagging, don’t you then have a realistic putt for par? The worst outcome is a 2 putt for a bogey.

Force clubs off the tee and just hit into no man’s land and suddenly you could score anything!

All par 5’s for 95% of golfers are THREE SHOT par 5’s! Don’t fool yourself that you can reach it in 2! If you can’t drive atleast 60-70% of the distance on a par 5 off the tee, your chances of hitting the par 5 in two is virtually 0.

So I say that my scoring zone is 7 iron (more realistically 8 iron) down, what happens when I have an approach outside the 7 iron mark, do I lay up? Well no not at the level I play but if I have 6, 5, 4 iron or more, I am not thinking about the pin. I am thinking of “around the green”. If I strike it well and I get on? Bonus. If I strike it well and get close to the pin? Fortunate. Outside my scoring zone, I open up my target area and just get it in a reasonable spot. I have learnt as soon as you try and “force” clubs beyond your comfort zone, the chances of hitting a poor one sky rocket. If I have 5 iron to the green and I hit it solid and leave a short pitch or a chip, I am never disappointed with the result and will take my chances getting up and down. Sometimes with these “less confident clubs” I will actually aim to the best side of the green to miss, or slightly short of the green and try to hit a good short game shot and sink a putt.

Just my thoughts….

Topic: AB: The Gloves Come Off!

love AB uncuts post

par 5s are the worst for most weekend warriors and mid handicap players

why – because they always feel they need to rip driver and 3 wood…using the 2 lowest lofted lubs in the bag two times or 2 shots in a row is asking for trouble

A great game I play is “reverse golf”

on par 4’s I tee off with my 5-8 irons then hit 3 woods and hybrids on the second shot. My aim with 2nd shot is to get it close the green (on is a bonus) so the short game gets a work out

I also find with 3 wood in hand on the 2nd I start thinking ok where is the best place to miss the green – ie youre learning course management skills

I have often played to my handicap playing this game – it does put presssure on your short game – however your always playing from the fairway so you always get 3 chances if you like…Ok let me explain what chances means

chance one is 3 wood/5 wood/hybrid from the fairway

if you miss the green (likely) you get chance 2 which is then a chip or texas wedge from off the green)...you then get chance 3 which is a putt

at any point in the 3 chance phase you hit a great shot there’s chance a birdie will come or par at worst

however if you take driver from the tee and go OB or lose it…..there is no chance 2 and 3…kaput hole over

playing this way increases the odds of scoring

Look pros only hit between 55-65% of fairways in a good week….WTF are we doing flaying away with driver on every hole

what you then learn is that when you go back to driver you then start going geez maybe 5 iron 5 iron is a better option than driver 9 iron on some holes

as AB said allot of ways to play the game..the worst thing is magazines and TV golf tells us “BOMB IT LONG”

ITS a load of friggin rubbish, yeah straight ionto the shizenhousin (bush)

unless youre playing some public goat track with no trees or rough

often the best way to become a better golfer is become a thinking one instead of trying to over power the course

Topic: AB: The Gloves Come Off!

Thanks for the help mate and also the day. Was definately awesome. For those of you reading I have not hit as many fairways as I did that day. From memory the only fairways I missed were when I used the hybrid and the Driver(only because I wanted to try Stinklers driver).

Fantastic day and good group one I’ll truly remember.(should have got a group photo).

Awesome to hear TJ’s home.Thanks again.

Topic: AB: The Gloves Come Off!

Sorry all, been very busy time. Picked up little fella from hospital yesterday and getting into routine over the next few days. Going to be a little time poor but I want to get it back the thread back on the golfing track.

A group of us played the magical Victoria Golf course on Wednesday and I had the pleasure of playing all the boys, and I played a full 18 with Alleging Bow as my partner.

AB2, is a great guy, who is also a great listener. He is ultra keen to learn so I decided to really help him get the concept of personal par and the results I must say even surprised me.

The highlight of the day for me was playing the 8th hole at Victoria 448 metre par 5. I think it is also a big illustration of how golf can be played in many different ways. Ab2 was playing off 26 and I was playing off +1…

I teed off with driver and hit it will but just slightly pushed it into the tree line (it took a bad hop and I was stuck under a small bush) I only had about 176 left to the green but had no swing and was blocked out.

AB2 asked me should he hit driver or 3 hybrid, I recommended his 5 iron and “just put it in play”, with his handicap he had 4 shots to get on the putting surface and then 2 putts for a “personal par”. I think if we are honest he was a little unsure of the tactics and seemed a bit disappointed with the strategy but to his credit he followed through and hit 5 iron. His strike was really good just a slight push but “in play” and 160 odd down the fairway.

We got to his ball and I told him to hit another one. He did, another slight miss but it bounded down the middle of the fairway and left him about 120 out from the green.

I had nothing from where I was, so playing my personal par, I chose to just punch it out down the fairway and leave myself a wedge for my third. I had 108 left for my third.

So interestingly already, AB2 has hit two 5 irons, I have launched driver and got in a little bit of trouble, and we are both in the middle of the fairway 12 metres apart.

Ab2 now hits a 9 iron onto the green around 30ft away. “There you go mate, two 5 irons and a 9 iron and you have covered a 458 metre par 5 AND have a regulation birdie putt and a personal par Eagle putt. You can 3 putt and still walk off with personal par!”

I hit my approach a low knock down wedge to 10ft just passed the pin.

Ab2 putts up to 3ft and the puts home an easy par 5 (personal birdie), I leave mine in the jaws for birdie and tap in for par.

This hole just illustrated to me, that playing the game to the skill level you have is the way to play golf. You don’t have to hit certain clubs, or certain shots, what you do have to do is hit the shots you can hit and play the hole to the skill level you have now.

I think this clicked for Ab2 as he hit 5 iron off every tee from that point, and he did not miss a fairway for the rest of the day. I know many of the people who are “anti” personal par will say “Yeah but he only got 160 off the tee! Driver could have got him closer!”

Yes that is true but it also could have got him in a lot more trouble and had him racking up the numbers! As Ab2 said to me later in the day “My driver is about a 1 in 10 club at the moment!”, so this says to me, in 14 possible holes he could hit driver on, he would play 1.5 good holes and 12.5 holes where he could potentially take heaps and wreck his card.

I am sure he will be the first to admit he had a lot more fun hitting from the fairway and he found his golf was a lot easier.

AB2 went on to make no real distasters on the back 9 and even made two fantastic pars on the back 9 par 3’s.

A highlight for me was watching him tackle the tough par 3 16th. He actually stood on the tee and said “I watched this hole during the masters and notcied over the back is dead and a tough up and down”. Ab2 then selected a shorter iron and played for just short of the green. He hit a wonderful shot finished just off the putting surface (and more importantly avoided the green side traps at the front). He then putted from off the green to 3ft and made a great par.

It’s not how in this game, it is how many.

Thanks Ab2 for letting me help you and for showing me that sensible golf is good golf. I think I learnt more about watching and helping you play golf on wednesday, than I did playing for myself.

Keep up the good work mate!

Topic: AB: The Gloves Come Off!

Hi AB congrats on baby – hope your future golf experiences together are fun, I have enjoyed my own with number 2 son.

I have been away a bit from here and noticed your post re Fos on the thread that was shut down and hope you don’t mind me posting here.

I believe you will get great help from Fos – I like his style and look forward to how it goes. Fos seems the kind of bloke I relate to and one day would also love to catch up with him. I reckon Fos will be reading on here and I need to leave him a message – Buy the new Stevie CD In Your Dreams – the queen still reigns mate ! I miss our Stevie clips !!

AB – sorry to hijack your thread just wanted to say Fos was great and hope one day to have him back and enjoyed your post about him. Your thread going great also.

Always welcome to post here mate. Fos is a GENIUS mate his approach and knowledge is second to none. Big shame that he is not here mate, you guys are missing out on some great knowledge. I highly doubt he will be back here mate, why would he?

I seriously think Fos is a person that everyone can relate to, he is NOTHING like his posts indicate. He is real blue collar mate, much like myself, you work and fight for eveything you get for; you tell it how it is, no pussy footing around; and you don’t put up with liars, cheats or BS artists.

Unfortunately with golf, there are a lot of “silver spooners”, guys who live outside of the real world, guys who get spoon fed everything. Unfortunately those same guys when they are told exactly how it is, often sook up and label people as crazy, off the wall, with “mental problems”. Not in my book, they are just not scared to tell you exactly what they think. With guys like Fos, you know where you stand and I personally like that. Nothing worse than someone pissing in your pockets and trying to tell you that it is raining.

Sometimes you can’t fit a square pegs into a world that is mostly filled with round holes ;)

Topic: AB: The Gloves Come Off!

Thanks for all the messages of support, they have been very much appreciated. I never knew it would be as tough a time as it has been over the past few days.

Little fella doing well, but it is still a 2 step forward one step back process. Mum is coming home tomorrow but little fella will be in there until at least friday and I don’t blame him…

He is in Club Med for babies!

Under the sun lamp, getting a tan… Chilling with the sunnies on… Nurses bring him drinks whenever he wants them… He is obviously not stupid this one! lol

I promise we will be back onto golf soon, haven’t had much to write about this past week. Victoria tomorrow….

Topic: AB: The Gloves Come Off!

Hi AB congrats on baby – hope your future golf experiences together are fun, I have enjoyed my own with number 2 son.

I have been away a bit from here and noticed your post re Fos on the thread that was shut down and hope you don’t mind me posting here.

I believe you will get great help from Fos – I like his style and look forward to how it goes. Fos seems the kind of bloke I relate to and one day would also love to catch up with him. I reckon Fos will be reading on here and I need to leave him a message – Buy the new Stevie CD In Your Dreams – the queen still reigns mate ! I miss our Stevie clips !!

AB – sorry to hijack your thread just wanted to say Fos was great and hope one day to have him back and enjoyed your post about him. Your thread going great also.