Topic: Your Favourite Golf Courses / Canadian golf

Cape Breton is just about at the top of the list of must plays for me - http://www.golfclubatlas.co...

Don't know where it rates though.

Topic: The Lounge / Bush Ballad

QUOTE: Dana Scully @ Mar 3 2006, 11:51 PM

Ah Jim have you read the age in recent times ?? Absolute left wing dull socialist drivel. Probably written by a bunch of teachers during lunchtimes.

Keep me out of this anyway nobody's ever accused me of using logic lets get that clear !!!

I get it every Saturday and just don't see it as terribly left wing. It is left of the Murdoch press, but so was Attila the Hun. I bought a copy of the Australian for the first time in years late last year and was stunned at how far to the right that had moved. It was hysterical. In some ways The Age has lifted its game, it has scored some good points against the Bracks Govt on its lack of vision and investment in the future, especially on urban development policy, the sagging public transport system and the lack of transparency in its dealings with the private sector. I'm sure tithers will be along shortly to set us straight on the matter.

Although Leunig is a wanker.

Peter, the recent IR changes may have some unintended consequences for Mr Howard, such as a shot in the arm for the union movement.

Topic: Golf Talk / Junior golf In Victoria

QUOTE: wrosloketr @ Mar 3 2006, 11:39 AM

so don't-please- come up with the tired old argument that the kids will give it away when they are confronted with membership fees.

Apologies also for quoting personal experience rather than blindly accepting mushy feelgood sentimentalities, but I went through a big junior program, and hardly any of them played past 18. Club golf just isn't that attractive an option in your late teens/early 20s, it takes a long time, you have to wear bad clothes, it can be expensive and you will rarely see a decent looking chick. And are you saying they don't give it away when the fees are jacked up? It is a sport where large numbers, especially males, will logically come to it later in life and they are basically ignored by clubs. I didn't say there shouldn't be junior development, but it sounds like, with the exception of Metropolitan, clubs are working their arses doing it. Every club I've been a member at has made a determined effort to attract juniors and basically none to attract the type of golfer mentioned by Lindsay. The focus just needs to be wider.

Topic: The Lounge / Bush Ballad

QUOTE: Jack @ Mar 3 2006, 08:56 AM

Jim, I have a lot of sympathy for you bleeding heart socialists, I really do.

Jack, if I was a socialist I'd be as happy as a pig in muck with their economic management. Howard and his cronies are amongst the biggest socialists going around. Problem is they a socially conservative socialists. The welfare and tax system has expanded ginormously under his watch. The tabloid reading unwashed are happy because he is stuffing their pockets full of family payments at the same time he is locking foreign looking children up in prisons in the desert. We are in desperate need of a finance minister of the ilk of Peter Walsh to clean up the waste.

Although it is a good thing the family tax benefit arrives about the same time as my subs.

Topic: The Lounge / Bush Ballad

QUOTE: Jack @ Mar 3 2006, 07:55 AM

It is impossible to please everyone all of the time.

Howard still manages to please most of the people most of the time. Thats why he continues to rate so highly in the opinion polls and keeps winning elections. There will always be the noisy MINORITY (AndyA, Jim etc) who grizzle about everything he does just for the sake of it. Thank God we live in a democracy where the government represents the MAJORITY and not the MINORITY view.

Jack.

Jack, the problem is the majority are tabloid reading zombies. Howards govt is socially conservative and fiscally permissive, which is about as bad as it gets for anyone who can think. There would be little doubt staunching the proliferation of internet porn is in his narrow minded conservative sights, and if he finds a way to do it you'll drop him like a hot potato.

Topic: Your Favourite Golf Courses / The short holes at Yarra Yarra

QUOTE: Hux @ Mar 2 2006, 07:27 PM

Basically the bunkers were shifted over to the right to stop slices.

How does moving a bunker fix a slice? This seems to be a favorite trick for mediocre architects to get more work, the idea that building bunkers can be a cure all that will fix boundary/safety issues. If anything, it will see the slicer aim further left and end up hitting a bigger slice, increasing the hazard.

Topic: Golf Talk / Junior golf In Victoria

Can someone post the article.

QUOTE: lindsay123 @ Mar 1 2006, 10:34 AM

Just a question... how many of the backbone of current clubs (probably males 40-70) were actually members playing golf when they were juniors under 18 or 21? i would say not many. most seem to join up to clubs a little later in life.

Therefore just because clubs dont have so many junior members, doesnt mean that the clubs are going to fall apart in 20 years does it?

Nice work Lindsay, junior development receives attention out of all proportion to its impact. They have little financial impact on a club and often give it away when they have to pay adult rates or their parents stop paying. Contrast with the recently retired footballer/cricketer/netballer who has money to spend and whose fashion sense is bad enough to wear the shocking clothes demanded by many clubs dress codes. 30-60 year olds are the ones to grab. Junior development is nice, but it shouldn't nearly be as big a part of the picture as its proponents make out.

QUOTE: Jeffrey @ Feb 28 2006, 10:16 PM

Links at Lady Bay is a well designed course. What other courses has he designed?

Exactly

QUOTE: dgstones @ Mar 1 2006, 09:17 AM

During your tenure as Manager at Warragul Golf Club, what type of junior program was in place to cater for the junior members then?

I think you'll find he was never the manager at Warragul or any golf club. He does do a great job on my tax though.

Topic: The Lounge / Bush Ballad

Don't let them get you down AndyA, Howard is leading a govt operating in a moral and ethical vacuum. He has just been extraordinarily lucky to be able run an extremely loose fiscal policy without triggering inflation, largely courtesy of cheap Chinese imports. He deserves to be thrown out, Beazley might be useless, but the impact of govt's is overstated anyhow.

Someone really should sue them for misleading advertising, there wouldn't be a liberal left in the part. Just a bunch of fusty conservative tosspots.

And anyone that describes the Fairfax press as commie trash would have to be a tool. It is very dull middle of the road. When did Dana Scully start using your login upanddown?

Topic: Your Favourite Golf Courses / Gisborne Golf Course

QUOTE: ttitheridge @ Feb 25 2006, 06:46 AM

Jim give it up, because in this case the pro shop got it 100% wrong.

The website didn't need specifics, because the club very clearly has a policy that the pro shop staff are to

inform all callers wanting to make a booking of the renovations.

The website doesn't take bookings, so all potential players will have to call the pro shop anyway. Thus, 100% pre-warning. The manager has returned from holidays into this thread completely unaware that it wasn't being carried out.

Some cork taint in that last red tt? I've clearly missed it, but where was the clear club policy of the pro shop informing callers of the renovations located. It is a cop out to blame the pro shop totally.

Topic: Golf Talk / Junior golf In Victoria

QUOTE: Jeffrey @ Feb 28 2006, 12:47 PM

And a pretty good course designer too.

That's the funniest thing I've read on here since Onewood asked how you swing a golf course.

Topic: ISG Feedback / Closing threads

QUOTE: Jack @ Feb 28 2006, 12:09 PM

Careful Jim, you'll get in trouble making comments like that

For saying you move in different circles to the Cashmores? Seriously, you know they have made a serious mess of their forum when they even manage to piss off tithers.

Topic: Your Favourite Golf Courses / Royal Melbourne changes - Too scared or who cares?

QUOTE: MatthewM @ Oct 23 2004, 10:36 AM

A quick visit to the RM website, and a flip through their club history reveal a mission statement as follows:
"The aim of the Royal Melbourne Golf Club is to 'to maintain the characteristics and challenges proposed by Dr Alister Mackenzie when he designed the course in 1926'. "

If they were serious about maintaining these characteristics they would have sought out the architects repsonsible for the best restorations/renovations of MacKenzie courses worldwide. From memory Hawtree has worked on one MacKenzie course and the work wasn't greatly received and Cashmore has a history of imposing his own style when working on existing courses. It is fair to say his style isn't in the mould of MacKenzie/Morcom/Russell - which could have been quickly ascertained with a quick trip by the RM board to Kingswood or Commonwealth. So if the club hasn't been sufficiently diligent in its selection of architects, as is arguably the case here, then they deserve everything they get. And the answer to the title is "who cares".

Topic: ISG Feedback / Closing threads

The Cashmore forum is a total waste of time and if I ever post in it again please slap me. Any comment should be made in the Golf Courses forum, away from the Cashmore hair trigger delete button. Wilsie's effort in locking the 7&8 thread because he felt he'd said enough was just the latest in a long line of disgraceful conduct. Just have a look at the Henley environmental disaster thread, which has shrunk from several pages to 6 posts, or their conduct with the intern "competition". The Cashmore's need to accept that forums such as these now provide for the first time critical commentary on golf courses. You won't get any sympathy from any other businesspeople that have to deal with reviewers, such as restaurants. Rather than attempt to manage any criticism in such a hamfisted manner, the answer is simple - improve the quality of you work.

QUOTE: Jack @ Feb 28 2006, 08:42 AM

I was at a function yesterday and spoke to two RM members, both single figure handicappers. Both were horrified at the new work on 7 & 8. I haven't met an RM member who has had anything postive to say about these changes.

QUOTE: cashmore @ Aug 10 2004, 01:17 PM

• Your opinion on the old uphill Hole 4, and of its ‘replacement’ is reasonable perhaps, but is certainly not shared by over 60 members who have taken the trouble to write to me or ‘phone me about the joy they experience with the new hole, and considered the old one “horrible”, “ugly”, “dangerous to adjacent tees”, “boring”, “unfair”, etc. Sure the tee shot is a little blind (the tees were designed to be higher, and the ridge concealed some intractable problems which couldn’t be excavated). If you find blind shots dangerous, bad, mate, (and they can be, especially with ill-mannered players), never, never go to, say, Prestwick! Why don’t you take a moment, climb the little hill designed to allow view into the fairway, and smell the flowers?
Cheers
Tony

Jack, the Cashmore's clearly move in different circles. I still haven't met anyone who likes the changes at Kingswood and have played with former long time members who resigned in disgust. So I'm not surprised they have managed to dig up some fans at RM.

Topic: Your Favourite Golf Courses / Worst Greens

I liked 8 at Peninsula South, it is a lot of fun and mostly fair. It is also a welcome change from the relatively bland and derivative stuff being dished up on most courses.

The 3rd on the National Old Course doesn't work for me.

Topic: Golf Architecture / UK Courses

QUOTE: Andrew @ Feb 22 2006, 09:07 AM

North Berwick was probably the most fun I have ever had on a golf course, although TOC was great as well.

You must have played there after we played National Ocean?

Topic: Your Favourite Golf Courses / Gisborne Golf Course

QUOTE: Fusion3000 @ Feb 23 2006, 02:57 PM

The final issue (which has been debated on this forum already!) is that the Proshop is indeed sub contracted by a pro, meaning that in this case, the views of the club are not reflected by the actions of the Proshop. A reasonable argument, and a problem that Giborne management hope to temper at the very least. I have no doubt that the Manager will be on top of this issue.

The pro doesn't set the green fee rates or run the website though, does he? I'm sure he's gonna love copping all the blame for this debacle.

The new 4th hole does look like it will be very interesting though, a par three of about 138 metres backing onto the water with a jelly bean type shape green.

Does anyone know if they have any plans to bulldoze the 14th tee, probably the most ridiculous (and uneven) tee I've ever seen. It must be the next to go.

Topic: Your Favourite Golf Courses / Yarra Yarra

QUOTE: St. Andrews @ Feb 23 2006, 04:00 PM

Check out

Golf Architecture with T Cashmore...there's been a bit of activity on the thread today

One Post! I think we need to start posting in here where James Cashmore isn't a moderator. It isn't like they bother replying to questions in their own forum anyhow.

Topic: Your Favourite Golf Courses / Yarra Yarra

Perhaps I was imagining things but I was sure I saw a thread on here recently talking about proposed changes at Yarra Yarra. Does anyone know what is going on (both with the link and the course)? Thanks.

Topic: The Lounge / Things that annoy the crap out of me....

The Cashmore's constantly going berserk and editing and deleting any posts that don't show them in the most favorable light in the Golf Architecture Forum. Its a forum for discussion James, not free advertising.

The Cashmore's having a golf architecture forum that they hardly ever bother responding to. The enthusiasm with which they have taken to the delete and edit buttons suggest they are only doing it in an attempt to staunch discussion of all the "controversial" work they have been doing.

QUOTE: Dana Scully @ Feb 23 2006, 03:19 PM

hehe no unfortunately no age limit ! but there are heaps of nice young girls playing these days, esp in the pennant stuff
hcp b/n 15-17 usually

I've played plenty of Dallas Brooks events and I would certainly counsel any male golfer from entering in the hope of getting a decent perve. The "nice young girls" are few and very far between.

Topic: Golf Talk / Joining a club in Geelong area

I'd join Curlewis. Really good track and can't cost that much.

Topic: Your Favourite Golf Courses / Gisborne Golf Course

QUOTE: vjay03 @ Feb 22 2006, 11:08 AM

The same place described in thread below with terms of "sound management", "common sense", "right people", "book a trip"? Ummm..

Hell hath no fury like a golfer spurned. Are you suggesting because it has been talked up in the past it should get a free pass? No punches pulled here, although I'm pretty sure it was never raved about for its customer service. You also forgot the link.

Can't imagine that Warrnambool would be any different!

Topic: Golf Architecture / Trees, lets do it again

QUOTE: James Cashmore @ Feb 17 2006, 11:20 AM

You're right in saying that there's been some good threads running for the moment, but not many that has required Tony's direct input.

I will say that the site has improved considerably since the mindless rambling of a select few has been replaced with good constructive debate. Intelligent comments wil be talked through and the rest will be ignored.

James, it would help if you and Tony (or Todd and thesaint) actually bothered to post more than once in a blue moon. The problem is you don't bother to talk through most comments, intelligent or otherwise. It was evident from the start that Tony was only going to post sporadically, and that simply doesn't cut it. 184 posts in 19 months for a guy with his own forum is nowhere near enough and it is little wonder you cop the odd pasting. If Tony can't post then perhaps someone else on his payroll can. Afterall, other golf course architects offices Australia wide seem to have a permanent connection to ISG.

Topic: Your Favourite Golf Courses / royal adelaide

Tithers, I saw that post on GCA and my first impression on seeing the photos was "how ugly is that bunkering".

7 looked especially shocking. Were they there last time you were there and who did them? And do they look that terrible in the flesh?

Topic: Your Favourite Golf Courses / Gisborne Golf Course

QUOTE: ttitheridge @ Feb 21 2006, 11:41 PM

In that context, I think you are far over-emphasising the website. Gosh, most clubs have one person at best who even knows how to alter a website, and if they aren't around for a while or a bit busy at work then it all stops.

I've made a point on here that general customer service is in a time wharp at golf courses. I hardly think that regional organisations that are run largely by unqualified volunteers should be looked upon to definitely form the nucleus of any change in this culture.

Tithers, its updated every week for comp results. They have no excuse, we aren't talking about a Heathcote or Lancefield here. You simply shouldn't need to ask when making a booking if the course is undergoing major works. With the arrival of Growling Frog and the new Sunshine and Eynesbury courses looking to be on the way it is simply stupid of them to annoy so many people with such a blatant lack of disclosure in an increasingly competitive environment. At the least they should be discounting the rate and explaining why.

I remember being stunned playing Sorrento a few years ago when each player received a new ball in lieu (don't get too excited by lieu tithers ) of the second hole having a temporary green. A rare example of smart customer service which other clubs could learn from.

Topic: Your Favourite Golf Courses / St Andrews Beach

I'd be jumping on this one fellas. Awesome track and much cheaper than a trip to Barnbougle.