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Club Champs - Grade Cuttoffs And Field Size...opinions Sought


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#61 hack2489

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Posted 16 February 2018 - 08:19 AM

I've given this some more thought, overthinking analytical personality and all ... :rolleyes:

 

Again. Call me naive, but why aren't grades set by Golf Australia. One grading across the country and be done with it. That way, a B Grade at club x is the same as a B grade a club Y. 

 

Club champion should be based on gross scores over 4 rounds (sat & sun, a week apart), with say only the top 25% of the field playing last two days.

 

Match Play should be a separate event, which can be played and scored in conjunction with normal club comps.



#62 Rusty_Chopper_1984

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Posted 16 February 2018 - 08:51 AM

I think for a lot of A graders, nett is just a non entity in terms of wanting to win it. As has been mentioned the gross total is what you should be aiming for.

As for grades, the fact that they have any part in club championships is just a farce.

You might as well just hand out trophies "for participation".

Who in their right mind 30 years from now, is going to want to look up and see a TBPTHNWAOOM trophy staring back at them from their mantelpiece? :o


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#63 iRON MiCK

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Posted 16 February 2018 - 11:24 AM

That is the winner of the club championship...


Sweet

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#64 iTurf1.0.2

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Posted 16 February 2018 - 05:26 PM

And Mouldy.


Gee fancy lumping a genuine c grader like Iron Man with a self confessed manipulator like Dad ..... That's harsh
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#65 golfguy33

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Posted 16 February 2018 - 05:31 PM

I have seen this type of system before & I do not like it. Firstly the scratch to 6.4 group is likely to be very small thus increasing the chances of winning but mainly You are shutting out anybody above 6.4 from winning the club champs. Impossible you might say , But it isn,t. I can think of 3 instances at least. where a marker around 7 - 12 has won a club championship.If you want to throw Match play into the list. Let the winner be match play Champion.


Is it the reading part that confuses you or the comprehension of what you've read or partially read ?
I will quote myself, " Open section, which anyone can qualify " with the lowest 8 scores etc etc.
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#66 pom

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Posted 17 February 2018 - 07:00 PM

i would very interested to know has anyone or know anyone with a high handicap of say 25  ever one a club championship  , not just C or D grade but the overall club championships?

 

I know you would have to shoot the lights out over 4 rounds and i understand it isnt likely  to happen 

Best I know of was a 15 marker winning a club championship. Small club only a couple of true A graders. Both had shockers.

 

Ok, call me crazy, or well maybe even naive, but, why have ANY grades for club championship?

Open field. Best gross over 4 rounds. Have a cut after 2, to drop out the choppers, and then run a smaller field so others can get on and play.

Net score works for monthly mug, etc. But, FFS, club champs?

No Grades for one of the most important events of the year. Easy answer. No field. You would get the top 10% of players . Rest would give it a miss.

 

There should be club championship and separate to that, a match play championship.

This is by far the best way IMO. Can anyone come up with a Major Open Championship played with 2 rounds of stroke & 2 of Matchplay?

 

I've given this some more thought, overthinking analytical personality and all ... :rolleyes:

 

Again. Call me naive, but why aren't grades set by Golf Australia. One grading across the country and be done with it. That way, a B Grade at club x is the same as a B grade a club Y. 

 

Club champion should be based on gross scores over 4 rounds (sat & sun, a week apart), with say only the top 25% of the field playing last two days.

 

Match Play should be a separate event, which can be played and scored in conjunction with normal club comps.

Because of the way memberships are in different clubs if there was one system for setting handicap levels you would end up with clubs that would have up to 50% of the field in A grade and another that would have 2 % if say the handicap cut off for A grade was set at 12

 

Is it the reading part that confuses you or the comprehension of what you've read or partially read ?
I will quote myself, " Open section, which anyone can qualify " with the lowest 8 scores etc etc.
Jon...

I was more thinking of a longer marker in the Matchplay. How would he qualify in the open side if he was in the B grade competition.Remembering that nearly everything is done by computers these days. And as posted above. What Open championship can you think of that is played with 2 rounds of stroke & then Matchplay. Excluding club Championships?The whole idea of 4 rounds IMO is to make it like the competitions that the Professionals play. Matchplay is a totally different game from stroke play.


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#67 Monty85

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Posted 19 February 2018 - 02:00 PM

I don't think your solution is to change the grade cutoffs, but to create a new grade (A-Reserve).

 

Our club had a similar issue with 50% of our members falling in the A Grade category which meant players that fell in the upper bracket of that group really had no chance of winning anything come championship time.

 

The players in B Grade and C Grade generally all have a shot at the scratch titles in their respective grades but a player off 8-10 is never going ot beat a +2 marker over 4 rounds no matter how good they played.


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#68 ozdevil

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Posted 19 February 2018 - 08:26 PM

you will never get club champs perfect.....

 

last year our club ran it over 3 weeks the majority of club said we cant do it and gone back to origional format...

 

lets just face it  this is the true A grade event and if ya on song 4 for rounds of stroke  ya most likey to take it out

 

there is always going to be some unhappy campers doesnt matter how well  you get the format right


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#69 golfguy33

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Posted 19 February 2018 - 09:52 PM

Best I know of was a 15 marker winning a club championship. Small club only a couple of true A graders. Both had shockers.

 

No Grades for one of the most important events of the year. Easy answer. No field. You would get the top 10% of players . Rest would give it a miss.

 

This is by far the best way IMO. Can anyone come up with a Major Open Championship played with 2 rounds of stroke & 2 of Matchplay?

 

Because of the way memberships are in different clubs if there was one system for setting handicap levels you would end up with clubs that would have up to 50% of the field in A grade and another that would have 2 % if say the handicap cut off for A grade was set at 12

 

I was more thinking of a longer marker in the Matchplay. How would he qualify in the open side if he was in the B grade competition.Remembering that nearly everything is done by computers these days. And as posted above. What Open championship can you think of that is played with 2 rounds of stroke & then Matchplay. Excluding club Championships?The whole idea of 4 rounds IMO is to make it like the competitions that the Professionals play. Matchplay is a totally different game from stroke play.

Not sure you are comprehending the concept of a CC being open to everyone, regardless of the grade you're in via your handicap. If a 15 marker can qualify or play 4 rounds with a lower score than the rest of the field then they will win !

And I'll take a moment to point out that the average golfer in this country is about 55 years old and has a GA of around the 20 mark ! So how do you manage to get 50% of the field into the open section or A grade via handicap and under a 12 GA ?

Why would any club try to emulate what the pro's do re strokeplay ?

I think you need to have a good hard look at what and how the best and the oldest clubs in the nation conduct their CC's, try telling RM or KH they MUST play stroke for 4 Saturdays in a row to get a result, sorry but it's a laughable suggestion really :)

 

Jon...    


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#70 pom

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Posted Yesterday, 07:42 PM

Not sure you are comprehending the concept of a CC being open to everyone, regardless of the grade you're in via your handicap. If a 15 marker can qualify or play 4 rounds with a lower score than the rest of the field then they will win !

And I'll take a moment to point out that the average golfer in this country is about 55 years old and has a GA of around the 20 mark ! So how do you manage to get 50% of the field into the open section or A grade via handicap and under a 12 GA ?

Why would any club try to emulate what the pro's do re strokeplay ?

I think you need to have a good hard look at what and how the best and the oldest clubs in the nation conduct their CC's, try telling RM or KH they MUST play stroke for 4 Saturdays in a row to get a result, sorry but it's a laughable suggestion really :)

 

Jon...    

Not laughable at all. Some clubs do it one way. some do it another. If you check you will find that the average age you mention is slanted by the smaller country clubs who,s numbers tend to be dominated by older members. Many of the bigger city clubs have an average age of members substantially lower than your numbers. also the fact that club champs. Be it 2 rounds or 4  tends to scare off a lot of the older members who just wish to play stableford every week.

 I can introduce you to a large club that runs a 4 round stroke competition in 4 grades for club championships. Those grades are A 0- 6. A1 7-12. B 13-19. C 20 + The 2 biggest grades by far are A1 & B

 Adding the numbers of A & A1 together makes up approx  55% of the field. C grade being the smallest grade with less than 10% of the field.

 And for your information I have run several Club Championships & have tried both formats. As I stated before. Not that either format was wrong. Just that " I do not like the 2 rounds then M/Play format"


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#71 PerryGroves

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Posted Today, 10:38 AM

you will never get club champs perfect.....

 

 

 

 

 

I think you need to have a good hard look at what and how the best and the oldest clubs in the nation conduct their CC's, try telling RM or KH they MUST play stroke for 4 Saturdays in a row to get a result, sorry but it's a laughable suggestion really :)

 

Jon...    

 

Maybe not Oz but you can get close, there are hundreds of years of champs play across courses Australia wide, the most common format remaining is 2 rounds of stroke qualification (same day or consecutive weekends) and then matchplay including KH and RM as Jon points out. Not that hard as a club to simply follow the lead.

 

I don't know many clubs that do 4 rounds of stroke, the 36 hole qualifying day is always good fun at all the courses I have been a member.

 

If you are interested (as we are) in having more people involved you can reduce the number of qualifying rounds for B and C grade.

 

Any B or C grader is welcome to have a crack at the club champs, just has to do one more round of stroke.






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