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Black Tees / White Tees


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#16 Itchy4Scratch

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Posted 06 February 2018 - 05:47 PM

A couple may not be enough.


Enough for what? C graders nearly always win the medal days off the back tees.
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#17 Francie

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Posted 06 February 2018 - 06:06 PM

Enough for what? C graders nearly always win the medal days off the back tees.

 

Our MM, off the back tees at Southern, and perpetual Shield went to a C Grader yesterday with net 71.   He also had a NTP on the 12th (flag on the top level) to 65 cm.   :rolleyes:


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#18 Itchy4Scratch

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Posted 06 February 2018 - 06:09 PM

Our MM, off the back tees at Southern, and perpetual Shield went to a C Grader yesterday with net 71.   He also had a NTP on the 12th (flag on the top level) to 65 cm.   :rolleyes:

Probably hit a 3 wood I assume?



#19 Francie

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Posted 06 February 2018 - 06:12 PM

Probably hit a 3 wood I assume?

:D    He is a "young" bloke....but most of them are to me now......who knows...he still might have.  :unsure:  


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#20 Itchy4Scratch

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Posted 06 February 2018 - 06:14 PM

:D    He is a "young" bloke....but most of them are to me now......who knows...he still might have.  :unsure:  

Young blokes are the worst ;) 


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#21 PerryGroves

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Posted 06 February 2018 - 06:27 PM

 I believe Golf Clubs have done the correct thing by introducing 'Gold' Tees for high handicappers but maybe the next step is to introduce an option of play off the white tees when the competition of the day is off the tips.

 

Vossy, we have had a white tee stableford option on any day where we have a blue course (whether stroke or stableford) for a couple of years. I have been a little surprised as to how poor the take up has been however most blokes play a fourball for beer bets so it kinda mucks with that.

 

Not sure of the legality however I did hear of one club where you could start in the stoke comp and if you lost a ball and couldn't be arsed going back to the tee, you could take a wipe and transfer to the stableford.


Edited by PerryGroves, 06 February 2018 - 06:27 PM.


#22 Bluethunda

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Posted 06 February 2018 - 06:33 PM

Slope rating was designed to play off any colour tee as long as men play off men rated tees in the Como, ie,, white ,blue, black and women same.just depends on how the comp is setup. I think they play it like this at the Grand.
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#23 *Mouldy

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Posted 06 February 2018 - 06:54 PM

It really is an individual course decision.

Vossy and I are both Keysie members.

There is 1 difference in the slope between the tees which I think accurately reflects the relative difficulty. However, there is 2 difference in the minimum DSR which I believe is far too much.

The first step I believe our club should do is as per Northern.

After their renos they took the scores of all single figure players over 12 months (Snappy can confirm if it was longer). Then taking the average scores per hole they rerated the holes. Par 3s came in and 5s went out. The same would certainly happen with 12,15 and 1,2 at Keysie.

As the system is based on stableford that step must happen first. Then after 12 months you can look at scratch ratings.

Meanwhile you have to totally re-invent the slope system as it is total garbage. Keysie and many Sandbelt courses are around the same which is just wrong.
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#24 Bluethunda

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Posted 06 February 2018 - 07:37 PM

Enough for what? C graders nearly always win the medal days off the back tees.



They ALWAYS win the C grade Medal round at our B&M club
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#25 Snappy McSnapperton

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Posted 06 February 2018 - 07:41 PM

It really is an individual course decision.

Vossy and I are both Keysie members.

There is 1 difference in the slope between the tees which I think accurately reflects the relative difficulty. However, there is 2 difference in the minimum DSR which I believe is far too much.

The first step I believe our club should do is as per Northern.

After their renos they took the scores of all single figure players over 12 months (Snappy can confirm if it was longer). Then taking the average scores per hole they rerated the holes. Par 3s came in and 5s went out. The same would certainly happen with 12,15 and 1,2 at Keysie.

As the system is based on stableford that step must happen first. Then after 12 months you can look at scratch ratings.

Meanwhile you have to totally re-invent the slope system as it is total garbage. Keysie and many Sandbelt courses are around the same which is just wrong.

yep just like a broken clock Mouldy's right again.  I guess the point is to use actual scores than what a committee 'reckons'.

 

Same with the slope and scratch system.  Now it has been running for a while it should be reviewed based on actual scores instead of what the formula predicted previously. 


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#26 Bluethunda

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Posted 06 February 2018 - 07:51 PM

yep just like a broken clock Mouldy's right again.  I guess the point is to use actual scores than what a committee 'reckons'.
 
Same with the slope and scratch system.  Now it has been running for a while it should be reviewed based on actual scores instead of what the formula predicted previously.



Our B&M club rerated the holes on scores and our index 1 and 2 holes swapped around. Index 1 is Hole 2, par 4', a narrow drive dogleg left, fairway opens up round 150 out from green, bunker either side of green, slightly elevated, Agraders eat this hole for breakfast. Index 2 hole is par 4 13, hit over a 30-40 metre wide creek bout 40 from the tee, hazard down all left hand side, OOB all down right hand side, front and rear traps, OOB rear of green also. Fairway is wide as fcuk, so yeah actual numbers do dictate the toughness of the hole.
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#27 Snappy McSnapperton

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Posted 06 February 2018 - 08:15 PM

yeah you have to do it properly.  Golf Vic suggest only using single figure markers.  This makes sense as you are rating for giving one shot on a hole, not two.  personally I think we should rate for two shots as well, as then you also cater for C graders.  eg a long par 3 might get rated 4/30 but a long easy par 5 14/21 for example.  Choppers find different holes hard is my point. 


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#28 OldBogey

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Posted 06 February 2018 - 09:09 PM

You can rate a course for scratch golfers who generally play consistently.
But to rate a course, or individual holes, for higher handicapped players would need to take into account the manner and frequency of their stuff-ups, a virtually an impossible task.

Alternatively, just rate the course for an 18 handicapper, then deduct 18 for a scratch rating. Yes, there would be some inaccuracies, but no more than the complex system we're currently trying to make work.

#29 Bluethunda

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Posted 06 February 2018 - 10:21 PM

Interestingly I averaged the shots taken on the par 4 2nd hole index 1, at my old club from the cards of the Seniors and vets over a six week period and the average score was 4.2... Thought it would be a lot higher than that.

This hole had an elevated tee, hit over a valley, where fairway sloped severely left to right, OOB down RHS, a hill bout 120 metres out, where fairway sloped towards a dam with a carry of 30 metres into an elevated green with OOB behind green.
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#30 voss

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Posted 07 February 2018 - 09:14 AM

Vossy, we have had a white tee stableford option on any day where we have a blue course (whether stroke or stableford) for a couple of years. I have been a little surprised as to how poor the take up has been however most blokes play a fourball for beer bets so it kinda mucks with that.

 

Not sure of the legality however I did hear of one club where you could start in the stoke comp and if you lost a ball and couldn't be arsed going back to the tee, you could take a wipe and transfer to the stableford.

Yes understand, but I am really talking of universally making the white tee optional for all Clubs. Can't agree with your second point ... sorry !






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