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#46 Weetbix

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Posted 19 April 2017 - 07:34 AM

Hey Weeti, can you explain what you mean by "reverse pivoting"?


It's when your turn actually gets your weight moving back towards your front foot and you lose the spine angle you set up at address

At the top of your swing your spine should stay leaning a bit right (for a righty). If you reverse pivot it ends up almost straight up and down.
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#47 GPJ_Longdriver

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Posted 19 April 2017 - 07:46 AM

"plane across shoulders"? How so, GPJ?

 

If you drew a straight line, thru both shoulders, where does the end of the line point to?

 

If you come in too steep you'll hit the ground before the ball ......... too shallow and you'll get the opposite.


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#48 hack2489

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Posted 19 April 2017 - 08:05 AM

Thanks Weeti n GPJ

#49 hack2489

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Posted 20 April 2017 - 12:12 PM

TL:DR - got better contact and found the swing fault. Wedge struck solid.

Reflecting on the range session yesterday, and watching video I took with my phone, it would appear a couple of days away from the range has helped.

Solid contact on more than 50% of the 6 n 7 irons. Shot video, and took 3 shots before a fat shot, divot inch or more behind the ball.

No reverse pivot.

It's an "over the top" movement with my arms.

Shoulder turn so back 100% to target.

No slide back with hips. Good turn. Weight inside right leg.

But, hands going WAY too far behind me, so it's an over arm, over the top motion to get them back.

Cool. Can work on that.

Hit a few with Driver, more for novelty, and using the new swing, I got one middle bat... WOW, solid piercing ball flight. Few pulled left, couple face open slice. But generally feeling positive for new Driver. CAN'T WAIT !!!

Hit new 52 deg, vokey, F Grind. Solid. 10 balls, non fat. 6 landed dispersed around a coffee table area. Divots from ball forward. 2 right, one left, one thin.

Finished session on wedges. Still have solid contact, clean divot, ball contact first, feeling and sensation.

Might give range a miss and do some chipping and pitching work. Need to get the feel of new clubs around the green.

Edited by hack2489, 20 April 2017 - 12:14 PM.

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#50 hack2489

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Posted 20 April 2017 - 03:27 PM

TL:DR - session trying the new wedges around the green went quite well.

 

Just finished a short game session.

 

First up, I hit a dozen solid wedges using range balls I picked up off the pitching green when I cleared it. Good contact again, good divot after the ball. Used PW (43 deg), Wedge (47 deg) and to Vokey 52 deg. Hands on club, with right hand fully anti clockwise, left hand with 2 full knuckles and 3rd just showing (i.e. full swing grip for irons etc.) delivers solid contact.

 

Then I started pitching into the green, flag was 30m away (rangefinder) using my game ball x 5. Used from PW through to get a 'feel' of the clubs. Normally would only use a PW from that distance, but wanted to get a feel for the new wedges. On the whole OK, good close dispersion, albeit mostly short. Few left of target (alignment at address) and few right (cross breeze) but length OK. Happy with first session with new wedges like this.

 

Hit 3 range balls from bunker using 60 deg vokey, all fluffed out nicely and travelled ok distance and direction.

 

Then I took the game balls x 5 over to the putting green to do some chips and putt them out in 'game mode' ... my short game approach here (as I wrote before) is to pitch from a 'dropped lie', do all 5, then grab the putter and finish them off. Goal being to get up and down, at worse a two putt. So, if 'on course' that would be (assuming drive and approach shots were not duffed or OOB / unplayable) an up and down to save Par, or at worse a bogey.

 

I did 6 sets of 5.

 

1 x W (47 deg) ... surrounded the hole. Finished of 3 with one putt, and other 2 for two putts.

 

1 x PW (43 deg) ... bit hit n miss. Some long, some short, some left, one really weird. Got 3 in for one putt, others in for two putts. Good scrambling.

 

1 x 56 deg vokey ... not pretty, and would not normally use this club from those lies. Grain of grass back at club, so too easy to flub the shot, which I did x 2, others stopped quicker, and short. So putting was a scramble but managed 1 one putt, 3 two putts and one triple.

 

1 x 8 iron chip n run ... not close to hole at all, all long, so made it a scramble to putt. But, scramble I did and 3 x one putt, 1 x 2 putt and 1 x triple.

 

2 x whatever best for lie and length:

  • Played 5, with a different target hole for each shot, then went and finished them off. Target's were clockwise around the chipping green for a 2 x one putt, 3 x two putt. Generally 4x used the 47 deg wedge, and one, with the PW, which in hindsight could have been better with an 8 iron (i.e. sitting in a low lie, semi divot, ball below surrounding grass)
  • Next and final 5, played for a variety of lies and went anti clockwise around the green. Used 47 deg wedge for all, and was able to finish off 2 for one putt, 2 for two putts and one for a triple.

Have a sense and feeling of the wedges.

 

PW (43) and W (47 deg) in the AP1's and the 52 deg Vokey, will be good full to half swing clubs, with the PW and W, being good for chip n run closer into the green.

 

60 deg Vokey is their for sand, and the odd high lob up and over a bunker etc. and it will do this well for me.

 

The 56 deg Vokey has an interesting spot in the bad. Could easily be dropped out if I needed say a Hybrid or another fairway wood, but, ATM, it can stay and will most likely be for those longer sand shots, and maybe some half swing to full swing high, stop them dead or spin back shot inside say 50m (i.e where the deg too long and the 60 deg too short). We'll see in time, 'on course'.


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#51 Madambo

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Posted 21 April 2017 - 10:08 AM

TL:DR - session trying the new wedges around the green went quite well.

 

Just finished a short game session.

 

First up, I hit a dozen solid wedges using range balls I picked up off the pitching green when I cleared it. Good contact again, good divot after the ball. Used PW (43 deg), Wedge (47 deg) and to Vokey 52 deg. Hands on club, with right hand fully anti clockwise, left hand with 2 full knuckles and 3rd just showing (i.e. full swing grip for irons etc.) delivers solid contact.

 

Then I started pitching into the green, flag was 30m away (rangefinder) using my game ball x 5. Used from PW through to get a 'feel' of the clubs. Normally would only use a PW from that distance, but wanted to get a feel for the new wedges. On the whole OK, good close dispersion, albeit mostly short. Few left of target (alignment at address) and few right (cross breeze) but length OK. Happy with first session with new wedges like this.

 

Hit 3 range balls from bunker using 60 deg vokey, all fluffed out nicely and travelled ok distance and direction.

 

Then I took the game balls x 5 over to the putting green to do some chips and putt them out in 'game mode' ... my short game approach here (as I wrote before) is to pitch from a 'dropped lie', do all 5, then grab the putter and finish them off. Goal being to get up and down, at worse a two putt. So, if 'on course' that would be (assuming drive and approach shots were not duffed or OOB / unplayable) an up and down to save Par, or at worse a bogey.

 

I did 6 sets of 5.

 

1 x W (47 deg) ... surrounded the hole. Finished of 3 with one putt, and other 2 for two putts.

 

1 x PW (43 deg) ... bit hit n miss. Some long, some short, some left, one really weird. Got 3 in for one putt, others in for two putts. Good scrambling.

 

1 x 56 deg vokey ... not pretty, and would not normally use this club from those lies. Grain of grass back at club, so too easy to flub the shot, which I did x 2, others stopped quicker, and short. So putting was a scramble but managed 1 one putt, 3 two putts and one triple.

 

1 x 8 iron chip n run ... not close to hole at all, all long, so made it a scramble to putt. But, scramble I did and 3 x one putt, 1 x 2 putt and 1 x triple.

 

2 x whatever best for lie and length:

  • Played 5, with a different target hole for each shot, then went and finished them off. Target's were clockwise around the chipping green for a 2 x one putt, 3 x two putt. Generally 4x used the 47 deg wedge, and one, with the PW, which in hindsight could have been better with an 8 iron (i.e. sitting in a low lie, semi divot, ball below surrounding grass)
  • Next and final 5, played for a variety of lies and went anti clockwise around the green. Used 47 deg wedge for all, and was able to finish off 2 for one putt, 2 for two putts and one for a triple.

Have a sense and feeling of the wedges.

 

PW (43) and W (47 deg) in the AP1's and the 52 deg Vokey, will be good full to half swing clubs, with the PW and W, being good for chip n run closer into the green.

 

60 deg Vokey is their for sand, and the odd high lob up and over a bunker etc. and it will do this well for me.

 

The 56 deg Vokey has an interesting spot in the bad. Could easily be dropped out if I needed say a Hybrid or another fairway wood, but, ATM, it can stay and will most likely be for those longer sand shots, and maybe some half swing to full swing high, stop them dead or spin back shot inside say 50m (i.e where the deg too long and the 60 deg too short). We'll see in time, 'on course'.

Hey Hack good session!

 

If you want to toughen up your practice go to a two ball routine.

 

Drop ball and play as you would on under course situations- close enough to one putt or in.

 

Then second shot, same drop but use as a way to reinforce your first shot if it was good, or fix the shot if it was bad.

 

Then move to new position around the green and do again.

 

When having multiple shots like you have its possible to fall into a rhythm and practice in different mindset that isnt reinforcing something you are working on.

 

Practice with different clubs as well from same location so you can start feeling how balls react from different lofts. ie Play an 8iron when you normally would use a wedge. Get creative and build confidence.


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#52 hack2489

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Posted 22 April 2017 - 05:14 AM

... If you want to toughen up your practice go to a two ball routine.

 

Drop ball and play as you would on under course situations- close enough to one putt or in.

 

Then second shot, same drop but use as a way to reinforce your first shot if it was good, or fix the shot if it was bad.

 

Then move to new position around the green and do again.

 

...

 

Good idea.

 

I just need to get a feel for the new wedges first, so I know with some certainty how they respond, and which club to use for the given lie and approach angle and issues (i.e. grass grain, roll of green, distance, anything to fly over, roll vs drop it dead, etc.). Not knowing the clubs yet, I think I'll move to the 2 ball idea after a few more 5 ball sessions.

 

I'm just amazed at how many people are using the crappy range balls for their short game practice. :huh:


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#53 Madambo

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Posted 22 April 2017 - 05:41 AM

I'm just amazed at how many people are using the crappy range balls for their short game practice. :huh:

Agree-  some ranges say you have to use their balls to practice there- not sure if you see that where you are. No use to practice with balls you dont normally use, unless just focusing on a technical item. 


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#54 hack2489

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Posted 22 April 2017 - 05:53 AM

... some ranges say you have to use their balls to practice there- not sure if you see that where you are. No use to practice with balls you dont normally use, unless just focusing on a technical item. 

 

I can understand on the open range for irons, full wedge shots, etc. ... But, close work, like chipping?

 

It's a bit touch and go with pitching where I go (Royal Chinderah) as the pitching green is just off to the side of the main range. A stray ball from the range would easily get me while walking over to pick up my balls off the pitching green. That's why I try to do that practice when it's not so busy, and when no one else is using the pitching green.


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#55 Madambo

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Posted 22 April 2017 - 06:04 AM

I can understand on the open range for irons, full wedge shots, etc. ... But, close work, like chipping?

 

It's a bit touch and go with pitching where I go (Royal Chinderah) as the pitching green is just off to the side of the main range. A stray ball from the range would easily get me while walking over to pick up my balls off the pitching green. That's why I try to do that practice when it's not so busy, and when no one else is using the pitching green.

Or at 530 in the morn?;)


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#56 Madambo

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Posted 22 April 2017 - 06:10 AM

I can understand on the open range for irons, full wedge shots, etc. ... But, close work, like chipping?

 

It's a bit touch and go with pitching where I go (Royal Chinderah) as the pitching green is just off to the side of the main range. A stray ball from the range would easily get me while walking over to pick up my balls off the pitching green. That's why I try to do that practice when it's not so busy, and when no one else is using the pitching green.

Fully agree!


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#57 hack2489

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Posted 23 April 2017 - 11:38 AM

TL:DR - had a walk around a course yesterday and found a new miss-hit. Starting to work out "on course" distances for the new clubs. Getting feeling for the new wedges and close to green work with them.

 

Walked 20 holes yesterday afternoon, carrying the clubs - love the new carry / stand bag. Leg's felt it by the end, so too my feet. Back held up much better than expected. Not as tight and sore this morning as I had expected. Going to need new shoes if I keep walking!

 

Got a good gap between groups, so played a few balls from the same spot trying to figure out actual distances with the new AP1's.

 

Still trying to figure it out even now.

 

Hit a couple of 4 iron and 5 irons there were long and straight, but forgot to remeasure (with rangefinder) when I got to the ball. I "think" I got one 4 iron 180m. One 5 iron, was 155m out and it dropped at the front edge of the green - I think the sprinkler head was measured to the font edge, but not sure.

 

I was TRYING not to HIT the ball, but swing the club, and put into play the swing changes recommended, including really making sure my grip was the 'new' correct set up.

 

Some ugly shots too.

 

Got a NEW miss hit - a weird, must be super open face, shot where the ball flies off the right. Not a slice, not a shank, but felt very toe-ish and divot was very deep to the too side. These were on wedges shots. Purely sequence issue I suspect.

 

Putting was generally good, but greens had been cored and sanded, so not an ideal test. Really didn't worry about putting as the walk was for the irons.

 

Driver - had to have a swing, see what it felt like, would do, with the new swing and grip. Lost sight of it, but felt it went OK, hit another, it felt weird, lost sight of it too. Suspected it went way off. Walked the fairway, looking ... found them both. The first, 210m from the tee (rangefinder measure) and the other, the second, about 20m short of it ... both just, like 10cm into the first cut. Hmmm. Would like to have seen the ball flights.

 

Wedges were very hit and miss - see note above re the weird miss hit.

 

Tried different clubs, for the up and down saves. Some I wouldn't normally do, but executed OK. PW and W were OK for the chip n run, but really depended upon the lie. Felt more comfortable with the 52, 56 and even 60 deg for high chip / pitch with less roll.

 

56 deg, lobbed well, with it and the 60 deg very nice from the sand.

 

52 deg, full shots had the weird miss hit. But, got a couple solid too. MUST not over hit this club. BEST TO SWING IT.

 

Mixed bag of distances. I'm feeling the new clubs 'on course' WITHOUT OVER HITTING, just a good solid swing, for which I can control accuracy and therefore consistency, will be around:

  • 4 iron - carry of 165m, roll out 170-175m (depending upon hardness of landing surface)
  • 5 iron - carry of 155m, roll out 160-165m (depending upon hardness of landing surface)
  • 6 iron - carry of 145m, roll out 150-155m (depending upon hardness of landing surface)
  • 7 iron - carry of 135m, roll out 140-145m (depending upon hardness of landing surface)
  • 8 iron - carry of 125m, roll out 130-135m (depending upon hardness of landing surface)
  • 9 iron - carry of 115m, roll out 120-125m (depending upon hardness of landing surface)
  • PW (43*) - carry of 105m, roll out 100-105-110m (backspin, stop dead, or kick forward)
  • W1 (47*) - carry of 95m, roll out 90-95-100m (backspin, stop dead, or kick forward)
  • 52* SM6 - carry of 85m, but likely a less full shot club so more like 75m.
  • 56* SM6 - carry of 50m, as not a full shot club for me.
  • 60* SM6 - carry of ?? - not sure, doubt it will even be a full swing type club. More sand and high lobs <20m.

 

Interestingly with this:

  • 7 iron - carry of 135m

That is EXACTLY the carry distance I get on the driving range. Hmmm.

 

And, this:

  • 5 iron - carry of 155m

I know the shot yesterday, hit from tee side of the 150m marked sprinkler head (measure to front of green?) and the ball landed and stopped on the uphill of the front edge of the green. Divot mark was about 15 - 20cm to the right, green side, of the where the ball had landed, so I know it had no roll. I'm going to walk onto the course today and check the distance with a rangefinder - should have done it yesterday. Idiot.

 

The SWING?

 

Yep, no where near confident with it. Just not grooved. Just really don't know what the f*&% I'm suppose to be doing with it ... yet.

 

Suspect hands are WAY too tight. Due to new grip and changes. Need to loosen up. What will impact be on overall swing?

 

New grip is good. Keeps swing solid, contact solid and consistent.

 

No 'handsy' feel, so totally more consistent.

 

Over the top still coming it the downswing BECAUSE I SUSPECT my hands get too far outside at the top, so have to be 'swung back over' to get back to the ball.

 

Shoulder turn good.

 

Hips back OK, good.

 

Legs holding strong.

 

BIG issue is getting hips to rotate and weight moving forward before the arms take over on the forward / downswing.

 

STILL swinging with arms WAY TOO MUCH. Gotta get the sequence right and consistent. Have to TRUST the swing, let it work.


Edited by hack2489, 23 April 2017 - 11:39 AM.

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#58 Madambo

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Posted 23 April 2017 - 06:04 PM

TL:DR - had a walk around a course yesterday and found a new miss-hit. Starting to work out "on course" distances for the new clubs. Getting feeling for the new wedges and close to green work with them.

Walked 20 holes yesterday afternoon, carrying the clubs - love the new carry / stand bag. Leg's felt it by the end, so too my feet. Back held up much better than expected. Not as tight and sore this morning as I had expected. Going to need new shoes if I keep walking!

Got a good gap between groups, so played a few balls from the same spot trying to figure out actual distances with the new AP1's.

Still trying to figure it out even now.

Hit a couple of 4 iron and 5 irons there were long and straight, but forgot to remeasure (with rangefinder) when I got to the ball. I "think" I got one 4 iron 180m. One 5 iron, was 155m out and it dropped at the front edge of the green - I think the sprinkler head was measured to the font edge, but not sure.

I was TRYING not to HIT the ball, but swing the club, and put into play the swing changes recommended, including really making sure my grip was the 'new' correct set up.

Some ugly shots too.

Got a NEW miss hit - a weird, must be super open face, shot where the ball flies off the right. Not a slice, not a shank, but felt very toe-ish and divot was very deep to the too side. These were on wedges shots. Purely sequence issue I suspect.

Putting was generally good, but greens had been cored and sanded, so not an ideal test. Really didn't worry about putting as the walk was for the irons.

Driver - had to have a swing, see what it felt like, would do, with the new swing and grip. Lost sight of it, but felt it went OK, hit another, it felt weird, lost sight of it too. Suspected it went way off. Walked the fairway, looking ... found them both. The first, 210m from the tee (rangefinder measure) and the other, the second, about 20m short of it ... both just, like 10cm into the first cut. Hmmm. Would like to have seen the ball flights.

Wedges were very hit and miss - see note above re the weird miss hit.

Tried different clubs, for the up and down saves. Some I wouldn't normally do, but executed OK. PW and W were OK for the chip n run, but really depended upon the lie. Felt more comfortable with the 52, 56 and even 60 deg for high chip / pitch with less roll.

56 deg, lobbed well, with it and the 60 deg very nice from the sand.

52 deg, full shots had the weird miss hit. But, got a couple solid too. MUST not over hit this club. BEST TO SWING IT.

Mixed bag of distances. I'm feeling the new clubs 'on course' WITHOUT OVER HITTING, just a good solid swing, for which I can control accuracy and therefore consistency, will be around:

  • 4 iron - carry of 165m, roll out 170-175m (depending upon hardness of landing surface)
  • 5 iron - carry of 155m, roll out 160-165m (depending upon hardness of landing surface)
  • 6 iron - carry of 145m, roll out 150-155m (depending upon hardness of landing surface)
  • 7 iron - carry of 135m, roll out 140-145m (depending upon hardness of landing surface)
  • 8 iron - carry of 125m, roll out 130-135m (depending upon hardness of landing surface)
  • 9 iron - carry of 115m, roll out 120-125m (depending upon hardness of landing surface)
  • PW (43*) - carry of 105m, roll out 100-105-110m (backspin, stop dead, or kick forward)
  • W1 (47*) - carry of 95m, roll out 90-95-100m (backspin, stop dead, or kick forward)
  • 52* SM6 - carry of 85m, but likely a less full shot club so more like 75m.
  • 56* SM6 - carry of 50m, as not a full shot club for me.
  • 60* SM6 - carry of ?? - not sure, doubt it will even be a full swing type club. More sand and high lobs <20m.
Interestingly with this:
  • 7 iron - carry of 135m
That is EXACTLY the carry distance I get on the driving range. Hmmm.

And, this:
  • 5 iron - carry of 155m
I know the shot yesterday, hit from tee side of the 150m marked sprinkler head (measure to front of green?) and the ball landed and stopped on the uphill of the front edge of the green. Divot mark was about 15 - 20cm to the right, green side, of the where the ball had landed, so I know it had no roll. I'm going to walk onto the course today and check the distance with a rangefinder - should have done it yesterday. Idiot.

The SWING?

Yep, no where near confident with it. Just not grooved. Just really don't know what the f*&% I'm suppose to be doing with it ... yet.

Suspect hands are WAY too tight. Due to new grip and changes. Need to loosen up. What will impact be on overall swing?

New grip is good. Keeps swing solid, contact solid and consistent.

No 'handsy' feel, so totally more consistent.

Over the top still coming it the downswing BECAUSE I SUSPECT my hands get too far outside at the top, so have to be 'swung back over' to get back to the ball.

Shoulder turn good.

Hips back OK, good.

Legs holding strong.

BIG issue is getting hips to rotate and weight moving forward before the arms take over on the forward / downswing.

STILL swinging with arms WAY TOO MUCH. Gotta get the sequence right and consistent. Have to TRUST the swing, let it work.
you articulate too well Hack! You had me at 'had a walk';)
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#59 hack2489

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Posted 23 April 2017 - 06:59 PM

you articulate too well Hack! You had me at 'had a walk';)

 

I need the journal log for myself ... short term memory issues. ;)

 

I figure, type it up here and I can go back and look at how many times I make the same mistake.


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#60 hack2489

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Posted 26 April 2017 - 04:52 AM

TL:DR - absolutely no f%$#ing idea. No confidence. Not a good swing at all!

Walked 9 carrying the clubs.

F%*$ me. What a **** swing!

Gotta go back to the range.

Some positives with short game though:

- beautiful out of sand to 5cm. Nice.
- 6 x chips/pitch from 30-40m to 4m. Made 3 of those putts, others within 50cm.
- putter was good. 6m+ all to within 50cm. Easy two putts. Not a 3 putt in sight.

Got one wedge from 95m (rangefinder measured) up and on, flag high, but 7m left. Putt to within 5cm for a tap in for par.

Got one 5 iron clean, albeit not solid. Just had no confidence. Traveled 145m (rangefinder measured).

Also checked 5 iron distance from previous round. Was 145m to its stopped dead landing on front edge of green. (the new on course 150m marker must be centre of green)

Hit driver again for novelty and to try new swing on longer club. If only I knew what I was trying to do!

The ugly, shoot off to the right, miss hit surfaced a couple of times. Hmmm. Weird. I'm sure its a confidence thing, arms, hands not getting back to ciose face for impact. Feels like club is making contact way behind me.

Looking up various drills for downswing start. That's key. Found good drill to stop over the top. Need to practice these daily, at home, as much as possible.

Long way to go...

Edited by hack2489, 26 April 2017 - 04:55 AM.





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