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Leadbetter's A-Swing Fundamentals.


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#1 Old Poppy

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Posted 10 July 2016 - 01:40 PM

I love David Leadbetter for claiming ownership of what he has named the A-swing. http://www.golfdiges...ing-starter-kit

What he claims is his conception was published in the 1930's by Abe Mitchell in his books "Essentials of Golf" and "Down to Scratch". A variation of Mitchell's concept was published in the 1960s by Joe Dante with " The Four Magic Moves To Winning Golf".

At least Dante had the grace to mention Mitchell in his book. Mac O'Grady once accused Leadbetter of passing his ideas as his own. A claim that Leadbetter denied.

#2 Can Break 80

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Posted 12 August 2016 - 07:39 AM

golf swing teaching comes in fashion waves.

 

used to be big long high back swing with lots of wrist break

then we went to short compact swings.

 

 then beach balls drill

 

towel under arm drill.

 

stack and tilt method

 

hogan swing method

 

Moe norman swing method.

 

now A  method


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#3 Jack_Golfer

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Posted 17 August 2016 - 01:03 PM

Good luck trying to emulate that swing from watching those videos!


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#4 Old Poppy

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Posted 17 August 2016 - 06:44 PM

Thanks Jack for redeeming this thread. On looking at the vids it is not what Mitchell and Dante taught via their books.

This is a new concept for Leadbetter.

#5 75@Dorset

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Posted 17 August 2016 - 08:59 PM

I hate Leadbetters voice and hat....

 

The swing, well I shall leave that to better golf minds/bodies than mine.



#6 Old Poppy

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Posted 17 August 2016 - 09:53 PM

This is my spin on what he's about.

In a good golf swing the wrists break in two dimensions - the thumbs move up and down, and sideways. The thumbs up is referred to as radial deviation; the thumbs down is ulna deviation. The wrists breaking sideways away from the target is flexion and towards the target is extension.

A square clubface at the top has the shaft and leading edge of the clubface aligned with the left forearm in a righty. The right wrist is extended back on the forearm with the palm under the shaft. The relationship of the shaft to the target depends on the extent of the shoulder turn.

During the downswing, the ideal position through impact is to have the wrists in flexion and ulna deviation. The flexion has the hands ahead of the clubhead (shaft lean) while ulna deviation locks the wrists and braces the forearm unit through the strike.

If the A-swing can achieve this impact position is debatable. It does achieve a two- dimensional wrist break but one that is open at the top and without the shaft aligned with the left forearm. Hogan had the wrists in a similar position in his best years. However he got there a little different way and supinated his left forearm early during the downswing to get to flexed wrists in ulna deviation through impact.

#7 Zenstb

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Posted 19 August 2016 - 06:44 AM

There is some criticism to the A-Swing, however there is some method to the madness. There is merit within the A-Swing that can help some golfers with better synchronization of the upper body and arms being connected in the back swing sequence. How this helps is from 3D data I have captured on average golfers is a commonality we see with the average golfers is they start the backswing with the arms first. The arms reach the top of the back swing first, the shoulders and hips lag last and as a result the arms start the downswing first.Arms first swing results in lost of consistency and distance .Some of the benefits I have seen with the A-swing is it allows you to start the backswing with shoulders then the arms follow. The arms arrive at the top of the back swing last. The A-Swing changes the sequence of the back swing, giving the golfer a better chance to start the downswing lower body first, followed by upper body and arms. Worse case patterns is start the down swing upper body or shoulders first, followed by the arms and the release of the club.We call this A 3 stage kinetic link. A 3 stage kinetic can be effective enough to play great golf and we have seen successful US tour players have this 3 stage pattern. They may not hit the ball as far as a 4 stage kinetic link. Although a positive is the 3 stage kinetic you can be very accurate and consistent.
There is some merit in the A-Swing that could help golfers. It's nothing new, good coaches generally teach connection of the shoulders and arms for the backswing sequence, It's a common back swing pattern we see in tours players. Although as a positive I feel its good Leadbetter put a name to this sequence because it's well explained that could benefit many golfers.

Edited by Zenstb, 19 August 2016 - 06:48 AM.

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Coordination is the key to movement

 


#8 Jack_Golfer

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Posted 19 August 2016 - 01:36 PM

There is some merit in the A-Swing that could help golfers. It's nothing new, good coaches generally teach connection of the shoulders and arms for the backswing sequence, It's a common back swing pattern we see in tours players. Although as a positive I feel its good Leadbetter put a name to this sequence because it's well explained that could benefit many golfers.

 

If only!



#9 Big Bopper

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Posted 28 October 2016 - 12:24 PM

Want to bump this.Have a buddy struggling with this swing.Did great all summer and now he is snap hook after hook.What went wrong? Is it a stuck move ?

#10 Old Poppy

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Posted 28 October 2016 - 12:46 PM

Want to bump this.Have a buddy struggling with this swing.Did great all summer and now he is snap hook after hook.What went wrong? Is it a stuck move ?

Probably a multiple of things. Usually it has roots in the players swing concepts. A snap hook is a fast rotating clubface through impact with the toe of the clubface making contact with the outside quadrant of the ball.
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#11 Big Bopper

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Posted 28 October 2016 - 01:07 PM

Addition: one thing I notice is he developed a nasty flying elbow from this.I bet he is stuck with right elbow stuck behind him.

#12 Old Poppy

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Posted 28 October 2016 - 06:05 PM

Addition: one thing I notice is he developed a nasty flying elbow from this.I bet he is stuck with right elbow stuck behind him.

That will do it. The ideal is to keep the trail elbow inside the right hip joint. It can move away from the body and still stay inside the hip. The concept is to move the wrists past the elbow in the backswing and start the downswing with the left hip the trail elbow as a single unit. The longer the wrists stay behind the elbow the later the hit.

#13 Big Bopper

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Posted 28 October 2016 - 08:35 PM

Just can't see all this manipulation holding up when any pressure is on.For an amateur golfer

#14 Old Poppy

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Posted 28 October 2016 - 09:51 PM

I doubt that most amateur golfers use their wrists and their body correctly, if they did their game would hold up (as you put it). It is the easy way to play once a player gets the gist of it and owns it. Unfortunately it is not taught by club pros, because it was never taught to them. It does explain why our National squad players can win National Open events against minor tour professionals. The Queensland Open is the latest example.

The golf swing is pretty darn complex for most golfers. Popular golf instruction tries to simply the swing using broad terms rather than precise instruction. I guess it boils down to how much time, effort and research a player is willing to commit to to understand the game and himself. We won't learn it by relying on others.

#15 Big Bopper

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Posted 28 October 2016 - 09:59 PM

I doubt that most amateur golfers use their wrists and their body correctly, if they did their game would hold up (as you put it). It is the easy way to play once a player gets the gist of it and owns it. Unfortunately it is not taught by club pros, because it was never taught to them. It does explain why our National squad players can win National Open events against minor tour professionals. The Queensland Open is the latest example.

The golf swing is pretty darn complex for most golfers. Popular golf instruction tries to simply the swing using broad terms rather than precise instruction. I guess it boils down to how much time, effort and research a player is willing to commit to to understand the game and himself. We won't learn it by relying on others.

well said sir.This method and other methods will get criticized from time to time.But in the broad picture they are trying to stream line the learning curve to hardest game in the world.Being a by the letter chap makes me relate to their efforts.But as we all know any sports motion endeavor is so individual.When one of us says you can't swing a club that way.Through some searching,you can find an individual that swung it that way and was very efficient.For me that is what makes this game such a frustrating task at times.There really is no right or wrong way to do this




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