This question was inspired by something Henry asked me.

How many great courses do you know of with a par of 69 or less ?

I can only think of 2, Swinley Forest & Royal St. David's.

Is there a stigma involved with a course that has a par of 69 ? Why ?

I've played some lesser courses over the years that had a par of 70 but thought they would have been a better course with a par of 69 or 68. I have also heard of committees that don't want to let the par of their course drop below 70, so they have turned a good par 4's into a weak par 5's just so they can keep a par of 70.

Joe

has this thread got some smutty hidden innuendo like the "henry hole in one" thread ?

look to the British Open qualifying many years. There are four or five regularly used tracks that are 68s or 69s, and very highly regarded by many of the Euro Tour players.

But I can't think of any others, especially once the tag "great" is required.

As for the state of Victoria down here, the best 18 hole sub par 70 courses I can think of are;

1-Flinders
winner by a long way

2-Beaconhills (Lakes)
a worthy runner up

3-Axedale
course near Bendigo with stunning greens and a very pleasant layout.

Honourable mention to Malvern Valley, not hard considering the quality drops away after the first two.

Tony,

I would rate Axedale well ahead of Beacon hills. One of the funnest ambrose or matchplay courses around. Plenty of fun holes with loads of options. But having said that, I would have thought that the greens at Axedale were the weak point.

As for the best course in the world with a Par of under 70...without a doubt it is Royal Melbourne West :wink:

joe

,
Don't know about it being a great course, but Luffness New, near Muirfield, has a par of 69, and is used for final qualifying at the Open: at only 6100 yards!
My Year 11 Maths teacher was a member there, and he told me that they had some of the best greens in Scotland.

Hudson Park

What about the front nine of RM (West)?

The original intent of this thread was probably thinking about the world stage, but I have given this a good deal of thought from a NSW perspective.

The other original thought is probably correct though. I'm sure a stigma exists that any course under par 70 would find hard to shake. Think par 68 and below and you think of short courses with no par 5's, short par 4's and the rest of the holes squeezed together to get the maximum out of the land available. Beverly Park, Bardwell Valley, Bexley and Kareela are perfect examples of this.

My old course Rosnay (par 68) actually has some good par 5's, but also some woeful par 4's, and the holes are all on top of each other.

The only genuinely challenging short course I can think of is Kiama, at par 66 but with some very good holes and always looks to be in excellent condition. Bardwell Valley is challenging, but not because it's any good.

I haven't played Mittagong or the Bowral courses for some time, but I recall one of those courses as par 68 or 69 and not too bad.

jimandr

,

I agree, Kiama is a lovely course.

I think Calderwood is a great little course Par 66 from memory

Billy

I have to agree with Bexley - you can get around the course (including normal course traffic) in 3.5 hours!

Billy Gunn,

Calderwood is a great little course but has a par of 70.
Not sure what it is rated at but probably would be close to 67.
At only 5112m of the blues it has some very short par 5's and par 4's for that matter.
But it is very enjoyable to play, especially with the mountains so close as a backdrop.

Mark

Mark,

Are you sure that it's Par 70 I just don't remember it being that high the course lenth you quoted definatly sounds right as it was short from memory.

It is a great spot though and the views are awesome and I think last time I played there it was only $14 or $16 which is such a bargin.

Billy

Blackheath is a very neat par 69. Has some nice short par 4's and the par 3 17 is a gem.

When ever I have played the course is always in good nick and the green are decent.

Billy,

Played there last weekend.
It's a par 70 for sure...

Mark

Billy,

Played there last weekend.
It's a par 70 for sure...

Mark

Well there you go

Cheers Mark

Billy